91 regular fuel sales banned from January

[monsterman]

Thai government today stated that sales of regular 91 octane fuel will cease from Jan 1st 2013

http://www.bangkokpost.com/lite/breakingnews/315484/no-more-regular-petrol-in-january

even though there are still thousands of vehicles that cannot be converted to gasohol 91 that includes many older motorcycles and also agricultural machines ,

for instance my wifes Honda Rebel 250 will not run on gasohol even with so called VITON Gasohol friendly carburettor kits from USA , the bike runs for about 200kms then the rubber carb parts melt with thai Gasohol
and I have spoken to many up country Thais with same problem .

sure some 95 regular is available but not all over the country so thats not a real solution.

 

[brian_bkk]

Read that too... Don't worry.. 10 people will rally and wear some funny coloured shirts and it will be extended another 6 months ;-)

 

[nikster]

that doesn't make any sense, so it's not gonna happen....

 

[TonyBKK]

Old news, Ray beat ya to it

https://www.gt-rider.com/thailand-motorcycle-forum/showthread.php/36437-Fuel-in-thailand

 

[TonyBKK]

nikster;283110 wrote: that doesn't make any sense, so it's not gonna happen....

It's precisely BECAUSE is doesn't make sense that we should be worried they might actually do it. TiT

 

[DesmoNut]

monsterman;283093 wrote: ...... will not run on gasohol even with so called VITON Gasohol friendly carburettor kits ......

According to the attached table, VITON is "marginal" in its compatibility with gasohol fuels (ethanol) while it's fine with petrol. Perhaps these kits are not all they're cracked-up to be. Looks like there are better materials than VITON but finding kits in those materials might be tricky.

The table's not mine - I saw it somewhere & thought it'd be a useful reference.

The table is extracted from the listing in this link http://www.allorings.com/compatibility.htm which is itself based on quite extensive research, I'd imagine.

 

[monsterman]

DesmoNut

thanks for the tabkle it will help my research , from chatting with American pals who have fitted kits to older bikes in USa the viton which seems to be the most common synthetic rubber used holdsup reasonably well to USA 10% spec gasohol , but it seems the Thai blend is more corrosive probably got laokhao, chemical waste and somtam in it .

BUNA seems the prefered choice in the classic bike world for upgrades so I will se if I can get some bits for my wife bike in BUNA , but this will be too much for up country Thai shade tree mechanics and farmers to get their heads around .

 

[KZ25]

monsterman;283093 wrote: ...my wife's Honda Rebel 250...

So you got a Duc and your wife a 30-year-old Rebel?

What kind of a husband are you?

 

[monsterman]

KZ she is oly n 148cm tall we want a bigger bike for her for a long time she is an excellent rider but even an HD sportser low is too tall have tried every factory 600 custo around all no good I will have to commission a special build custom for her shereally wants an Hd or a Kawasaki W650/800 chopped to same size as a Rebel.

oh and i have 3 dukes

 

[finnomick]

monsterman;283159 wrote: KZ she is oly n 148cm tall we want a bigger bike for her for a long time she is an excellent rider but even an HD sportser low is too tall have tried every factory 600 custo around all no good I will have to commission a special build custom for her shereally wants an Hd or a Kawasaki W650/800 chopped to same size as a Rebel.

oh and i have 3 dukes

A mate of mine's wife back in the UK is even shorter than this, and she's English. They had a sportster ' extra ' lowered for her at the local H-D dealership which made her very happy indeed. ( PS. have you read my post this week about helmets ? )

 

[KZ25]

Straying off topic a bit but weight may be a problem even if the bike has a low seat.

Have you guys checked out the Suzuki Savage since she seems to be into cruisers? It's low and not as heavy as a Sportster.

 

[David Race]

monsterman;283093 wrote: Thai government today stated that sales of regular 91 octane fuel will cease from Jan 1st 2013

http://www.bangkokpost.com/lite/breakingnews/315484/no-more-regular-petrol-in-january

even though there are still thousands of vehicles that cannot be converted to gasohol 91 that includes many older motorcycles and also agricultural machines ,

for instance my wifes Honda Rebel 250 will not run on gasohol even with so called VITON Gasohol friendly carburettor kits from USA , the bike runs for about 200kms then the rubber carb parts melt with thai Gasohol
and I have spoken to many up country Thais with same problem .

sure some 95 regular is available but not all over the country so thats not a real solution.

Just a thought on this subject did you ever think that because the Thai Government subsidies gasohol it would be in their interest to get rid of Benzine as soon as possible.
If they did this they can put what ever price they want to on gasohol and not have to subsidize this fuel.
The amount the Government would save is massive and I mean massive.

Just a thought.

 

[DesmoNut]

If this really is the end for benzene in Thailand, then it also means the end for many bikes currently on the road. For many, many months, I've been thinking about buying an older bike but have been hesitant precisely because I could see benzene not being available for much longer. I'm glad I put things off, now. It's likely to kill the market for older bikes stone dead almost instantly, now.

When leaded petrol was taken off the market in UK, it caused problems for people like me - classic bike enthusiasts (Dukes for me) - but the "fix" was a fairly simple matter of using fuel additives. This looks likely to be a far greater problem - nobody is going to make Thai-gasohol-proof seal kits for potentially hundreds (if not more) of different carburettor models, especially as carbs. are almost obsolete now. I'd recently been onto Dell'Orto UK about gasohol-friendly seal kits and they just weren't available nor were they likely to be. Don't know the UK/Europe situation with gasohol but from Dell'Orto's response I suppose it's not used there. Monsterman's earlier post here suggests it's used in USA but their seal kits aren't up to coping with Thai gasohol, it seems.

From the experience mentioned by Monsterman with his wife's Rebel, it's almost going to be a case of "Fill 'er up and a carb. rebuild please" when you visit a petrol station.

Oh, well, I'll stick with my current bike - it's unfashionable but good enough for my needs these days. Would've loved an old bike, though.

 

[Changnoi1]

In Brasil they should know about gasohol ....
The HOL of gas is produced in Thailand and that makes it an good reason to monopoly the use of it.
It seems stupid but is there no way of getting the HOL out of the gasohol?

I might become a good time to find some nice old-timer bikes ....

Chang Noi

 

[TonyBKK]

Changnoi1;283192 wrote: In Brasil they should know about gasohol ....
The HOL of gas is produced in Thailand and that makes it an good reason to monopoly the use of it.
It seems stupid but is there no way of getting the HOL out of the gasohol?

I might become a good time to find some nice old-timer bikes ....

Chang Noi

Even in Brazil you can still buy non-ethanol gasoline... It's a lot more expensive than gasohol, but it's still available.

 

[mbox999]

TonyBKK;283197 wrote: Even in Brazil you can still buy non-ethanol gasoline... It's a lot more expensive than gasohol, but it's still available.

Tony , i can't remember gasohol vs benzene in Brazil that much.... but Caipirinha / Cachaca sure made me running hot

It really wouldn't make sense to "ban" benzene 91 seeing that there are a lot still depend on the availability of it. Specially those who need this fuel on daily use for their 2 wheels or even farming equipment would suffer most IMO. Yeah, the market for older "Classic Bikes" would also immensely suffer ...( and i mean real classics not just a new bike labelled with some "classic" sticker) .

 

[DesmoNut]

Sorry to resurrect this thread but one of my earlier posts said that the potential problems with gasohol in bikes designed for petrol were putting me off buying an older bike.

A year after 91 petrol was supposedly outlawed, I'd like to ask whether anyone currently using gasohol in an older bike, designed for petrol not gasohol, has noticed any real problems. Does the bike run well? Have the anticipated problems with carbs. actually happened? I accept that fuel consumption might increase & performance reduce but that's not a real issue for me since I suspect that neither will be significant - or can you tell me different?

I still see a lot of older bikes on the road - Steeds, SR400s, CBRs for example - that I'd have thought would have suffered by using gasohol, so maybe the problems just haven't occurred. I certainly haven't seen any petrol on sale in local garages where such bikes might have filled up.

What sort of "older" bike am I thinking about buying? Maybe a 400 cruiser, SR400 Yam or CB400 Honda, not bigger than that. So if you have comments specific to those I'd be grateful, but any more general info. would be just as useful.

 

[monsterman]

DesmoNut;296062 wrote: Sorry to resurrect this thread but one of my earlier posts said that the potential problems with gasohol in bikes designed for petrol were putting me off buying an older bike.

A year after 91 petrol was supposedly outlawed, I'd like to ask whether anyone currently using gasohol in an older bike, designed for petrol not gasohol, has noticed any real problems. Does the bike run well? Have the anticipated problems with carbs. actually happened? I accept that fuel consumption might increase & performance reduce but that's not a real issue for me since I suspect that neither will be significant - or can you tell me different?

I still see a lot of older bikes on the road - Steeds, SR400s, CBRs for example - that I'd have thought would have suffered by using gasohol, so maybe the problems just haven't occurred. I certainly haven't seen any petrol on sale in local garages where such bikes might have filled up.

What sort of "older" bike am I thinking about buying? Maybe a 400 cruiser, SR400 Yam or CB400 Honda, not bigger than that. So if you have comments specific to those I'd be grateful, but any more general info. would be just as useful.

Some people have managed to get new seals and rubbers and jets for old bikes to work with gasohol but my experience with my wifes Rebel 250 is continuous faliures of carb rubber components even so called Gasohol friendly viton parts from USA and EU , so we only run it on benzine 95 or 91 .

 

[TonyBKK]

DesmoNut;296062 wrote: Sorry to resurrect this thread but one of my earlier posts said that the potential problems with gasohol in bikes designed for petrol were putting me off buying an older bike.

A year after 91 petrol was supposedly outlawed, I'd like to ask whether anyone currently using gasohol in an older bike, designed for petrol not gasohol, has noticed any real problems. Does the bike run well? Have the anticipated problems with carbs. actually happened? I accept that fuel consumption might increase & performance reduce but that's not a real issue for me since I suspect that neither will be significant - or can you tell me different?

I still see a lot of older bikes on the road - Steeds, SR400s, CBRs for example - that I'd have thought would have suffered by using gasohol, so maybe the problems just haven't occurred. I certainly haven't seen any petrol on sale in local garages where such bikes might have filled up.

What sort of "older" bike am I thinking about buying? Maybe a 400 cruiser, SR400 Yam or CB400 Honda, not bigger than that. So if you have comments specific to those I'd be grateful, but any more general info. would be just as useful.

^ 91 gasoline isn't available anymore in Thailand but it's been replaced by 95 gasoline, so folks with older non-gasohol compliant vehicles can still buy ethanol-free fuel, though it's a bit dear at nearly 49 baht/liter...

 

[ronwebb]

I was at an airfield in Chiang Mai today and was told that the people who have their own aeroplanes (the ones with one engine and a propeller at the front) have benzine tested regularly. They need to do this apparently as, unlike a motorcycle, when the engine stops, its a bit of a problem and so these flyers tend to be a bit picky.
They have found that benzine from PT stations always comes up trumps in terms of being what it is supposed to be. Others, like PTT, often fail. This is I am told is as a result of 1) PT have their own refinery and 2) because they do not constantly change the contents of their tanks at the stations from one type of fuel to another, thus blending, all be it in small quantities.
I hope this helps folk in need of benzine.

 

[Billy Baht]

I noticed rural several stations selling 95 benzene on my recent Northern Thailand trip. Just sayin

 

[michaels]

ronwebb;296089 wrote: I was at an airfield in Chiang Mai today and was told that the people who have their own aeroplanes (the ones with one engine and a propeller at the front) have benzine tested regularly. They need to do this apparently as, unlike a motorcycle, when the engine stops, its a bit of a problem and so these flyers tend to be a bit picky.
They have found that benzine from PT stations always comes up trumps in terms of being what it is supposed to be. Others, like PTT, often fail. This is I am told is as a result of 1) PT have their own refinery and 2) because they do not constantly change the contents of their tanks at the stations from one type of fuel to another, thus blending, all be it in small quantities.
I hope this helps folk in need of benzine.

Thanks for that info. Anyone care to mention some pt stations around in cm? Guess I've seen some, but can't remember where. :-/

 

[DavidFL]

ronwebb;296089 wrote: I was at an airfield in Chiang Mai today and was told that the people who have their own aeroplanes (the ones with one engine and a propeller at the front) have benzine tested regularly. They need to do this apparently as, unlike a motorcycle, when the engine stops, its a bit of a problem and so these flyers tend to be a bit picky.
They have found that benzine from PT stations always comes up trumps in terms of being what it is supposed to be. Others, like PTT, often fail. This is I am told is as a result of 1) PT have their own refinery and 2) because they do not constantly change the contents of their tanks at the stations from one type of fuel to another, thus blending, all be it in small quantities.
I hope this helps folk in need of benzine.

Good tip there alright. I will make the point of trying to fuel up at PT now.